Damn Democrats & Disenfranchisement
Better "Damn Democrats" than "Damned Democrats"... lol. Think about it.
The word for the day is "Disenfranchisement." And this blog is going to be a bit more scattershot than some others I've posted, particularly in the realm of politics. Just a ranting, a venting, a stream of consciousness babbling of some things I don't quite GET.... And I will break one of my general blog rules by using the f-word liberally (pardon the pun). Generally, I think of profanity as a short-cut for thinking. But upon occasion, I think a peppering of profanity can help make a point and spur people to ponder a point a bit more purposefully....
1) Why the fuck does Howard Dean insist on sticking to flawed Democratic Party "rules" - even when it means allowing Florida governor Charlie Crist and his Republican cohorts to say "Mission Accomplished!" on multiple fronts: essentially silencing Florida Democrats who voted in the primary, perhaps discouraging many of those Democrats from voting in November's general election, and dividing and (possibly) conquering the national Democratic party?
2) Rules sometimes need to be changed. And which rules should be at the top of the "must be changed" list? Rules that say "fuck you, your votes won't count" to two states (in this case Florida and Michigan) whose voters were not responsible for either the rules or the decisions their politicos made to violate the rules.... Punish the politicians, I say - not the voters. Why, when public officials do the rule-breaking, are the voters the ones to be penalized? Count the public's votes - and if you must make an example of someone, make it the real rule-breakers.
3) I'm sure you've heard people say, "The popular vote should determine the nominee. The superdelegates should follow the vote of the people and not swing the nomination to another candidate." Why are the folks who are most gung ho about letting the "vote of the people" (and not of the superdelegates, who apparently are not people) decide the nomination... why are these "vote of the people" proponents in many cases the same folks who want to essentially say "fuck you" to the vote of the people in Michigan and Florida, by insisting that the votes in those states do not count? And if they don't mean to say "fuck you" to those voters, why are they not doing everything in their power to ensure there is a re-vote of the people in those states? Makes sense, if counting the "popular vote" is your real reason for wanting to count out the superdelegates....
4) Why are many leading Democrats trying to pressure either Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama into leaving the race before all 50 states have had a chance to vote? I agree we need party unity - and sooner is better than later. But we also need to let ALL Americans who want to vote in the primaries have a chance to do so. If you want the nomination to be decided by March - and if that's in the best interest of the Democratic party - then why not let the people in every state VOTE before March? And if that's what you want, and also in the party's best interest, why in the hell would you penalize states (like Michigan and Florida) for moving their primaries back so they can vote before March?
Am I the only one who doesn't get this? I'm a staunch Democrat and we're supposed to be the party of "the people." So why are we not letting ALL of the people's votes count? That's why I think the f-word is appropriate in this blog. And I apologize if it offends anyone's sensibilities. But let's face it, the people are getting fucked here! I'm kinda used to the Republicans doing it - with their unprovoked wars, tax-breaks to Exxon-Mobil, thumbing their noses at our environment, and so on and so forth. But do we Democrats have to do it as well, by disenfranchising voters? It's not right. I daresay it's unAmerican.
Let every Democrat's vote be counted in this primary season. And then whoever wins a larger share of the popular vote, whether it's Obama or Clinton, should be the Democratic nominee. And we Democrats should unite to support that nominee. If the margin of victory is within a certain small percentage, or if neither candidate earns a majority of the popular vote, then we should seriously consider bringing the top two candidates together on one ticket to face the Republicans in November. What better way to ensure party unity and keep the lion's share of both leading candidates' supporters from being discouraged?
What's the alternative? Tearing each other's hearts out, handing the Congress and Presidency back to the Republicans, and likely enduring four or more years of the same old same old? Just thinking aloud here.... But it's enough to make a guy want to use profanity.
And The Minister says... fuckin' A, JC!
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Hahaha! Thank you, brother!
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Fuck yeah!
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LOL... that's what I like to hear!
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More whining from the Clinton camp.
She should have followed the rules. Michigan and Florida should have followed the rules. If you join a party, you are bound by it's constraints. Deal with it.
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I'm speaking as a concerned Democrat, not as a Clinton supporter. Clinton didn't break the rules. The Florida and Michigan politicians did. And Governor Charlie Crist didn't join the party, so he wasn't bound by the rules. Is that the Florida voters' fault? And either way, Democratic voters did NOT break the rules - so why should anyone insist that disenfranchising them is an acceptable solution?
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Unfortunately, I think the Dems have lost their way, and it's been bad for a long time.
I canvassed for them in 2004 but no more.
I don't see much difference between them & the Republicans. They present a public face that appears to be liberal. Meanwhile, they carpetbag the world with policies like NAFTA and free trade that ain't free.
Corporate powers misuse the perceived difference between the parties--and our fear that the worst of the worst will be elected--to impose policies that don't normally wash down lightly.
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I like your statement that "Corporate powers misuse the perceived difference between the parties--and our fear that the worst of the worst will be elected--to impose policies that don't normally wash down lightly." Makes me wanna swear again... at the corporate powers.
"The 2008 Beijing Olympics - brought to you by Coca-Cola, AT&T, McDonald's and the Church of Jesus Crimes of Adder Bray Taints. Thanks be to Gotti."
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oh i'm laughing!
"The 2008 Beijing Olympics - brought to you by Coca-Cola, AT&T, McDonald's and the Church of Jesus Crimes of Adder Bray Taints. Thanks be to Gotti."
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Its important that we teach our children that rules don't matter and that there is no reason to play by them when you can get what you want by other means. FL and MI must count.
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I think it's important for our children to realize that rules do matter - but also not to be blind or apathetic to the fact that some rules are undemocratic and unjust and ought to be changed. The Constitution is a beautiful thing. But in its original text it included a rule stating that each African-American slave only counted as three-fifths of a person. Fortunately, 90-or-so years later, that "rule" was amended and eliminated. Whether they're in the Constitution or in any other revered document or code, wrong rules (particularly those that deny basic rights like being a whole person, or counting a citizen's vote in an American election) need to be fixed, eliminated, or replaced.
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am i missing something? what about honor? what about sticking to your word?
hillary, michigan, and florida all agreed on the rules - now all three are whining about it.
what's worth, hillary is really trying to disenfranchise voters by say those delegates obama won in the primaries don't really have to vote for him just because they won - she says they should vote for her instead.
what was ugly, cheap, illegal and immoral in hillary before has just gotten a lot uglier.
i see no diff in the ethics of the cheneybush beast and the clintons - except bush has murdered maybe half a million more civilins than the clintons.
i read your arguments and wonder why the morality underneath isn't more fully explored.
the end NEVER justifoes such means.
(but i still respect you the morning after)
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All three candidates have been caught in lies. But "none of the above" is not an option in November. I'm not even trying to promote Hillary in this particular blog. I'm mainly mad as hell because the Republican Florida governor was the key behind Florida's primary being moved. He didn't agree to the rules - and he's more than happy to add as much shit to the game as possible. And you can see him gloating over it....
Maybe if I explored the underlying morality of American politics more deeply, I would cuss even more!
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well, i don't hate mccain. and even though i've always been a serious democrat, and even though i had a big crush on obama for a time, i may either vote for mccain or not vote. i'm hillary-bitter and i can't stop! i want a leader who is not afraid to kill in the name of love. is this mad? help...
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I respect that. I don't really hate McCain either. I have some respect for him even. But not nearly like I used to....
And Obama is easy to have a crush on.... Twice he's had me almost ready to climax - before the South Carolina primary and after his recent race speech. Of course these bouts of excitability had as much to do with the Clintons' fuck ups as they did with Barack's fuckability. His allure increases as theirs diminishes and wanes as theirs waxes, at least in my own personal experience.
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The party is split at the moment. Can it heal? I predicted this on February 17 in my blog. There is no underlying morality in politics anyway. But listen to Bill. He says be patient. It will all work out somehow. Nobody's gloating yet. It still is like the Kentucky Derby and someone has to win by a nose.
I still believe either Clinton or Obama could beat McCain but both would be a win win. Let's get a leg up and not do any splits right now. I am originally from Pennsylvania and they are crucial in this election both in the primaries and in the general election. Stop f..ing around and just see what happens.
The whooper dooper sooper delegates aren't the whole scenario yet and the rules are f....up. So what?
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February 17 you say? February is also an F word. And 17 taken backwards and subtracted is 7-1=6. Six is one third of the number of the Beast from the book of Revelation. And the sixth letter of the English alphabet is F.
6 6 6 - the number of the Beast.
McCain (6), Obama (5) and Clinton (7) - what would gematria say?
6+5+7 = 18 = 6+6+6 (oy vey!)
McCain, Obama and Clinton - oh my?
Wonder which one needs a brain, which one needs courage, and which one needs a heart... lol.
Just kidding people! Don't be offended. Just teasing.... If it ain't true, it won't hurt. Mwahahaha!
See what happens when I eat too many Nutty Bars?
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...them nutty bars will do it every time!!!!!! LMAO!
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Damn! I wish I'd saved at least one of those Nutty Bars for this morning. I'm fiending for them.
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*faster than the speed of a t1 line*
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g153/genres/nutty1.gif
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You're a godsend.
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*grins*
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i don't have a comment yet, but i can't subscribe to the blog without leaving one because i seem to have accidentally unsubscribed to the entire site. duh!
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At least on MySpace you could just leave kudos.
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ah! but here i can "vote and see results"!
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True! Kudos are so last year... lol
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please! i can't stop laughing!
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Amazing! I couldn't possibly disagree with you more.
You sound like a typical Hillary whiner.
As for the Florida/Michigan primaries...Didn't they BOTH know the rules BEFORE the primary?
I doubt very seriously you'd be taking this position if Hillary were ahead.
Hillary Clinton has done nothing but prove her self-serving agenda these past few weeks.
She is single handedly destroying the party because of her inabiltity to accept defeat.
My God! She's actually promoting McCain as a more worthy canditate that Obama..what does that tell you?
Hillary has done the work of the Republican party and as a result, we may actually have four more years of Republican rule....something I would have thought impossible as little as a month ago.
Thanks Hillary! Just like a Clinton..always looking out for #1
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With all due respect, my friend... and I'm not saying you don't make some good points.
Expressing the view that everyone should have their votes count may be the postion of, as you say, "a typical Hillary whiner." But it's also the position of Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, Abraham Lincoln, Theodore Roosevelt, Franklin Roosevelt, John F. Kennedy, Frederick Douglass, and Martin Luther King, Jr. Who happens to be ahead in the in 2008 primary vote had nothing to do with their decision - so it doesn't have to have anything to do with mine either. I have been disappointed with all three candidates this year - and many supporters of all three candidates.
Everybody keeps pointing out that Hillary's campaign knew the Democratic party rules. But she didn't decide to break them. The Republic governor in Florida and the Democratic governor in Michigan did. And whether it was right or wrong, the people deserve to have their votes counted in America. That's all I'm saying.
If I go to the polls in November and the local authorities fuck up and break the rules, is it fair to say "They knew the rules. Too bad! Your vote doesn't count!" When I the voter am not the one who fucked up? That's all I'm saying.
Obama's people knew the rules about superdelegates, which have been in place since, what, 1982? The Clinton people can whine about the Obama people's whining - and the Obama people can whine about the Clinton people's whining. And some of the whining on both sides is valid and some is not. But whatever side we're on, we should insist that everyone has a chance to vote - and that every vote has a chance to count. And if politicians fuck up, the people throughout our country should still have a chance to vote and have their votes counted. Period.
It's the American way, whoever one's candidate may be.
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Disenfranchisement - the act of withdrawing certification or terminating a franchise. I don't think she should withdraw herself. When our founding fathers came over from England to show the King of England that they were not going to be ruled by a monarch and built a FREE country here, he tried to fight them and bring our nation tumbling down. We all help to build this country to what it is today and without FREE speech, the ability to worship as our parents and their parents before them taught us, we are going to keep allowing non-believers push us to where we become a communistic country. Republicans just keep sucking the life from us and not to mention, the money from our pockets, by raising gas prices, grocery prices, etc. that when the piddly little $9.60 an hour I make for working 40 hours a week is gone, then they will wonder why I cannot pay my taxes to them on the property I own. Yes, I think it sucks that we get fucked over by our government and all their political bullshit but, what can we do?
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I WANT ONE OF THESE AS A BUMPER STICKER! I'LL DRIVE IT WITH PRIDE!!! ; )
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*sits back with a glass of whine*
well, my word of the day was this:
http://a934.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/119/l_cbb1a39746b11430bd7ac806f70b57fd.gif
but it seems to fit...
i wish i had something more fucked up to say here, but i agree with with every fucking word you said.
p.s florida lost a bush and gained a crist... something to ponder...
p.p.s. i'm really glad smith will still respect you in the morning *laughing*
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I've never heard that word before - believe it or not.
Goody... I love new words! And it fits so well.
Crist ... a surrogate Christ ... but lacking the H, which stands for holiness and honor.
No lack of horror, however....
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just call me dictionary.com
today's word is something all myspacer's can find in their "mood" category:
obsequious
try reading something by elizabeth peters someday. her amelia pebody series is fabulous, you'll learn a lot about egypt and england at the turn of the last century, and you will be carrying a dictionary around with you as you read.
Definition - servilely attentive; fawning.
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I agree with you completely. I've long since held the opinion that superdelegates should not be voting in the candidate; that it should be the popular vote ---- and I also agree that EVERY vote in every state should be counted before a candidate is chosen for its party. I'm proud to be an American and I recognize we enjoy many freedoms others do not but I also believe we have a LONG ways to go. There is much to be improved upon and this is a very good example of one of those things. (I also do not believe that foreigners should be allowed to own property within our borders, be they individuals or corporations/companies, but that is another argument altogether. LOL!) As for the occasional curse word ... we're in agreement on that too. Yeah, cursing can be looked upon as a lack of intelligence but I think there's a time and a place for it, nonetheless (and God only knows I've done my fair share of cussing whereas this country's politics is concerned). Keep up the great writing!
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Thank you, Michael! I greatly appreciate your comment.
We definitely have a long way to go in several areas. But hopefully we're making progress in several of them. I keep trying to console myself by remembering the great William Blake's statement that "Without Contraries there is no Progression." But I sometimes find it very easy to become quite impatient with the "Contraries," whatever they may be.
Peace, brother!
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What to think, FL and MI should have not been banned from the vote. Back in the day when the dates were changed who stood up and said "What is going on" they were not blindsided by this we were. In the end its up to the party to choose who they are going to have run. The bosses will choose regardless of who "We the people" choose. The other side is not 100% behind McCain but to have a chance at this they needed someone more down the middle and he is there man. They will all stand behind him and if elected the party will take control. Who is in charge of GWB? Are we really voting for one person are are we really voting for the party? Right now I'm not happy with the party, I'm kinda supporting BHOB now that Dennis is out of the race. I just wish we could have just one more party in the race but both the Dems and Reps have made sure that will not happen. The Corporate Media hasn't helped ether. If only everyone could get behind Nader... Talk about one person who has devoted his life to make all of ours better. There are so many things that need to change in this country. GWB has only made it worse in our eyes and the rest of the World.
OK here is an idea. I have been thinking about Tibet way too much but this idea could also work to change many things wrong with this country and on a large scale "The World". I have spent a lot of time in Nepal. I have a second family there and when I'm there it feels like home. Nepal has undergone much change in the past 10 years +. For the most part it has been done peacefully. They used what is called a "Bonda" or "Strike" The city and at times the whole country just shuts down (Kinda like Christmas Day) People don't drive, shops don't open, people don't goto work everything comes to a stop. What a better way to send a message to the government and the powers that be. This is so much better then a protest. In a protest we have to drive to the rally, buy supplies (Signs, markers ect) we need food and drinks while we are there. This only helps commerce and they don't listen to us anyway. OK, we get 2 mins on the news. All that time and effort for a sound bite. I say we start on Nov 3rd and 4th of 2008. We can all walk to the voting booth and support Diebold.
JC please feel free to pass this on, look into the whole Nepali Strike idea. There was just a program on Al Jezeera on YouTube on this very thing. Granted the Strike has been going on for some time and the people have suffered but a revolution has a price and as long as its peaceful it can move mountains.
JC, I have lived in Nepal so if you have any questions just e-mail me. I am currently living in Bangkok but I will be returning back to Cleveland on April 17th.
Thanks, FC
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Thanks, Ronnie! I'm kinda digging the strike idea... I need to reflect on it some more.
Wishing you safe travels back to the USA....
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i'm loving this strike idea., but i'm having a hard time imagining it being embraced by the even a small majority of people here in the US. then again, who knows?
last night's earth hour surprised me here locally. looking out the windows, i saw that many of my neighbors appeared to be embracing it. of course, they might not have been home or something, but there were several homes that were completely dark, making me think otherwise.
we threw the breakers and lit some candles.
i think most amercians think we're all that and then some. we force our way into places where we are not wanted because we're bullies. i know i'm not the only one who sees things this way.
it would nice to think that pipe dreams aren't always wishful thinking and that something really can be done to change things.
how do you even know where to begin? look are for an already established group? start your own?
this is bigger than all of us as individuals. the only way something like this strike idea would work would be if people banded together, which is, of course, stating the obvious.
now i'm rambling and thinking out loud, so to say. hunh. i just opened a chocolate and the fortune inside says "if they can do it, you know you can".
coincidence or fate?
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forgot to leave this link...
http://my.earthlink.net/article/top?guid=20080330/47ef1e50_3421_1334520080330-745496249
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Cool!
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http://my.earthlink.net/article/top?guid=20080330/47ef1e50_3421_1334520080330-1169228970
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Thanks for the link Meribeth. If you listen to Bill Clinton he and others have the right idea. It ain't over until its over and he was the one who said if Hillary doesn't win in Texas and Pa. she may lose. But she won, didn't she? My thoughts are re salvation of the Dem party so we win in Nov. and not who is ahead or behind at this point in time. They are both good candidates.
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my earthlink start page usually has some good articles to share that i don't see other places. i'm glad you enjoyed it. i am of a like mind with you on this, in that they are both good candidates.
i love yogi berra quotes
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blasted typos... hee hee...
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Excellent! I have posted this as a bulletin on MySpace.
Thanks, Meribeth!
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you're welcome john
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your session has timed out
or some such nonsense kept coming up when i tried to post a comment on your site...
anyway, here it is in brief...
you asked why, the answer is "the fix is in."
bob
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Say it isn't so!
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Oh... don't get me started on Howard Dean and the primaries... grrrr...
The Michigan and Florida primaries were both a mess. Therefore my vote will not be counted... because it was "someones" brainiac idea to move up the primary... now they are crying foul!!
I can't say anymore because it makes so mad I want to blow a gasket!!!
I'll come back when I cool off.
What a mess...
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Even though I voted in Ohio and my vote counted (this time), the whole Florida and Michigan mess makes me want to let a out a huge Howard Deanish caterwaul!
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...i'd like to know how many teeth this guy chipped when he decided to eat the microphone....??...hmmmmmm??
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I wholly agree with you... because it will most likely be the thing that will cost Hillary the nomination if it comes down to it. There are enough delegates at stake between Florida and Michigan to really make a difference. It honestly makes my blood boil thinking about it. Because they thought that they were doing such a great thing by moving the date up... without really think thru the ramifications of it...
Anyway... enough said...
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The politicians love to do things that look good at the time but are not fully thought through until it's too darned late.
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For all of you who are listening, Jon Corzine, Gov. of New Jersey, was on CNBC this morning. He agrees with all of the above and said it has to be the popular vote that wins the nomination. He also said the "rules" are wrong because it was the Republicans who insisted on the early primaries in Florida and Michigan.
Furthermore, Obama doesn't think that Hillary should give up now either. He wants to have a fair public vote decide the nomination and both candidates have stopped criticizing each other and are only comparing their issues (that are very similar) to those of McCain. Hillary or Obama must win fairly and that is on the minds of everyone in this race. Let the next 10 prmaries go on and see what happens. I heard Obama say something to the effect about super delegates to Chris Matthews yesterday. He did't think the "poo bahs" in the party should decide the election. I like the word "poo bahs" Both nominees realize that the important thing is to beat McCain. They are not stupid you know.
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True....
I can't help but wonder... if Obama wanted the people and not the poo-bahs to decide the nomination, why were his folks unwilling to go along with re-vote plans in Michigan. Not asking this to be critical... I just honestly wonder.
Both Clinton and Obama have used some tactics that have made me "uncomfortable" this primary season. That's politics, I guess. But either candidate is preferable (by far and on many different levels) to John McCain. I'm glad the Dems have (for now) put the gloves back on and reined in their surrogates. We don't need a replay of 1980, where Kennedy and Carter fought to the bitter end.
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Governor Rendell of Pa. was just reiterating what Gov. Corzine was saying this morning on TV. He thinks that Obama didn't want the Michigan primary to have a re-vote since Hillary would be ahead in the popular vote. If this is ever settled, and as of today it isn't, she may very well be ahead in the popular vote. Both Corzine and Rendell are governors and both think the popular vote should decide the outcome, and furthermore they both stated that the superdelegates can change their endorsements and they have until August to do so. Both say it is important to continue the 10 primaries and in addition the money raised at this point doesn't matter even if Obama has raised more money. The MAIN objective for either one is the POPULAR vote. Bill Clinton also says the same thing. So forget all these pundits that are trying to force Hillary to give up. I really don't think she can or will at this point. She is a real fighter and won't give up till the very end. Good for her!!
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I can help but be reminded to this line by Shakespeare:
"I shall fight till the flesh from my bones be hacked."
Give Florida and Michigan their votes and Hillary WILL win the popular vote.
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